Raising the bar on patriotism

21 September 2008 @ 8:30 pm | 5 comments

If paying more taxes is a way of showing your patriotism, then is this how we can show our love of country when we get universal health coverage?

The veteran Government adviser said pensioners in mental decline are “wasting people’s lives” because of the care they require and should be allowed to opt for euthanasia even if they are not in pain. . . .

Lady Warnock said: “If you’re demented, you’re wasting people’s lives – your family’s lives – and you’re wasting the resources of the National Health Service. . . .

“Actually I’ve just written an article called ‘A Duty to Die?’ for a Norwegian periodical. I wrote it really suggesting that there’s nothing wrong with feeling you ought to do so for the sake of others as well as yourself.”

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  1. NOYDMB’s avatar

    NOYDMB on 21 September 2008 at 8:53 pm

    Yet another reason why we shouldn’t want the government choosing who gets what kind of health care.

  2. David B’s avatar

    David B on 22 September 2008 at 9:36 am

    Strawman, yes? Yes.

  3. David H. Sundwall’s avatar

    David H. Sundwall on 23 September 2008 at 7:43 am

    David –

    I’m not saying it’s definitely going to happen here.

    But how does calling it a strawman argument make it less of a legitimate concern? (I’m not that up on my logical fallacies I guess).

  4. David B’s avatar

    David B on 23 September 2008 at 8:02 am

    Is it a legitimate concern? Sure–but so is the possibility that the propane tank on my neighbor’s grill will blow up (despite the fact that it gets taken care of properly, as far as i can tell), damaging that wall of my house. In other words, it’s something that’s possible, but unlikely to the point of nearly impossible.

    What you’re doing is quoting a single lunatic, and making it sound like that person is taking the normal position that someone who disagrees with you has. This makes it into not an illegitimate concern, but rather an illegitimate point for debate.

    If you want to avoid such fallacies, you at least need to include a (sincere!) acknowledgment that such positions aren’t the norm for people proposing or supporting (depending on whether their jurisdiction has it) universal health care.

    Of course, if you’re gonna insist on setting up strawmen like this, i can think of some right-wing lunatics i could start quoting… :-)

  5. David H. Sundwall’s avatar

    David H. Sundwall on 23 September 2008 at 11:12 am

    I don’t think either assertion are normal for people who disagree with me and didn’t say so. I think both lunatics (Biden and the ethicist) aren’t taken too seriously (most people don’t offer to pay more taxes voluntarily and yet are still patriotic) but I found the common sentiment interesting.

    That “ethicist” may be your random kook but too many ethicist are sounding more and more kooky and I find it a little alarming that someone who should be taken seriously can credibly express such an idea. More troubling than a random propane explosion.

    A word of warning: my posts can be sort of tongue-in-cheek and shouldn’t be taken as blanket condemnations of those who may disagree with me (as ill-advised as that is).

    You’re certainly right that there are plenty of wing-nuts who may be on my political “side.” I’d like to think I can disagree and denounce them for the kooks they are too.